Why Aren't Our Teachers Armed?

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Another school hostage-taking and shooting. Fortunately, only the gunman died this time, although he did shoot one girl.

Do we ever hear of Palestinian terrorists attacking an Israeli school? No, because the teachers in Israel are armed. Why aren't ours?

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Stay Puft Marshmallow Man said:

I'm sure there's a strong similarity between the situations in Isreal and Colorado, but I'm not sure what it is.

Kevin said:

uh, and cuz arming teachers is a pretty bad idea. Sounds like you're itchin to live in a militarized state?

Kenton Ngo said:

Teachers with guns? Gives "duck and cover" a whole new meaning for the newer generation of students...

Jack said:

Puffy: There isn't a similarity between Israeli schools and ours. There are differences: Their teachers have guns, and their kids don't get shot.

Kevin: (1) Why is keeping our kids protected a bad idea? (2) The teachers are not part of the military in Israel.

Jack said:


Might not have so many discpiple problems, either.

Kevin said:

One crazy dude shoots em up and you want to arm everyone? Really?

Jack said:

No, just the teachers.

But it hasn't been just one guy. Have you forgotten Columbine? What about the guy shooting an AK-47 into a school-yard?

Kenton Ngo said:

True. Nothing says "pay attention" like being held at gunpoint. Perhaps they ought to bring back the paddle, and introduce new discipline technologies, such as genital electrocution.

Please, though, only after I graduate.

Jack said:

I think we can skip the genital electrocution. As I recall, the paddle was sufficient "persuasion."

Stay Puft Marshmallow Man said:

okay, Jack, Israel is kinda under constant siege in a way that Colorado is not. If Utah, Arizona, New Mexico, Oklahoma, Kansas, Nebraska, and Wyoming were refusing to recognize that Colorado existed, I could see your point...

charles said:

I'm not sure I want the average teacher carrying a weapon into school.

But states with concealed carry don't have a greater incidence of accidental shootings, so generally arming the population doesn't really make things worse.

Unfortunately, the girl who was shot died.

There are hundreds of cases each year where an armed civilian thwarts a crime, and saves lives, but the stories get little national coverage.

I don't own a gun. But if someone ever breaks in my house and abuses my family, I'll probably regret it.

charles said:

On the other hand, schools are very safe -- the death rate is less for school hours than non-school hours.

Everyone should be armed. This would make a huge difference in local crime.

The criminals, sure as shootin', would tend toward places like DC and NYC where the innocent are helpless, and they would leave the good citizens of Virginia alone.

I'd gladly pay a $5 surcharge on my annual car tax if it would put a 9mm pistol in the hand of every legal resident of Northern Virginia.

Kevin said:

What about laws that say the criminals can't have guns? Those seem to be working nationwide as well.

Jack said:

Just because the schools are relatively safe, should they not be made more safe, if it can be done without cost? Simply allow CCW-holding teachers to carry in school.

zimzo said:

This sounds like Archie Bunker's idea to end hijacking by distributing guns to everyone on the plane before takeoff. In fact, a lot of your ideas sound like they were cribbed from Archie Bunker.

By the way violent gun crimes surged last year because of the efforts of the NRA and gun nuts like Jack:


Jack said:

Rehashing the same BS, Zimzo? One data point (a 1.4% rise in violent crime) does not make a trend. You lost this argument earlier (http://www.novatownhall.com/blog/2006/08/illegal_aliens_crime_and_gang.php).

The violent crime rate has been trending downward for years, and our violent crime rate is half the rate of our gun-controlled neighbor to the north.

Since gun control measures have been relaxed over the years, and more states have concealed carry, the violent crime rate has been trending downward. You will have to find another scapegoat for the 1.4% "surge" last year.

One place to look would be that the increase came mostly in mid-sized cities. These cities are seeing increased gang activity. Could that be a cause?

Stay Puft Marshmallow Man said:

Jack, I think I've seen you relate two statistics before, and make the leap of logic that the two are related. This logical problem is called "cum hoc ergo propter hoc" I think. You can't just assume that because two things happened at the same time they are related. At the same time that more people were carrying concealed weapons, the unemployment rate was dropping and the economy was strong. So you haven't linked the drop in crime to the rise in concealed weapons in any meaningful way.

Kevin said:

Hey Stay, did you hear the one about how ice cream causes violent crime to rise? Seriously, dude, it's true. As ice cream sales rise so does violent crime. Maybe that's why murders increase in my fair city the second you see them rolling out the snoball stands!

Jack said:

Well, I can also give some "post hoc ergo propter hoc" evidence. After Florida instituted concealed carry, violent crime dropped statewide, except against tourists. Crime against tourists rose. They were not armed.

We might also note that violent crime, indeed gun crime, increased in Australia when guns were banned. The same happened in England.

No Relation said:

Please, Joe. Not a 9mm. Research and experience have shown the stopping power im that round is nothing.

At least a .40 cal, please.

No Relation said:

Correction, "in that round" is what I meant.

Point taken. I was assuming +P ammo but that would be out of the reach of many in our society.

Jack said:

As Gordon Liddy once pointed out, "If the 9mm were worth a damn, the Pope would be dead." (That was John Paul II, of course.)

Just as a little aside, "John Paul II" was NOT his first choice for a name. The Cardinals nixed his first choice: "George Ringo"

But 9mm is better than a whistle, you must admit. I'd like to see all the women in my life carrying one of those cute little Kahr thingamabobs.

'Course what I'd REALLY like is to see the women in my life carrying pistol-grip Mossbergs with the 18 inch barrel. And I'd like to see the Dallas Cowboy cheerleaders dorming in the house next door.

Kevin said:

Speaking of which, on the way to work there was a guy on the sidewalk coming at this woman and she quickly reached into her purse and pulled a gun out and pointed it at him. He backed off.

Course she probably just got done robbing him or something. Who knows in such a chance encounter what the real story was. Drawing ones own conclusions without considering both sides, one often misunderstands.

Kevin said:

I only count two but then again I've been out of town for the past couple days. Enlighten me on the third.

Jack said:


The article I cited mentions the other two.

Kevin said:

Oh yeah, all the way down at the bottom. So. Ok, go ahead and arm em.

Jack said:

Sorry, Kev. I actually do read the articles people link to. I even read that whole Finkelstein thing. (I don't think I gained anything thereby, but I held out hope 'til the end.) I even read the "70-page legal memo" that VoteNoVA contracted for. (It was double-spaced, with lots of footnotes, so it's not as daunting as they make it out to be, and it was all B.S. anyway.)

Kevin said:

And you know, typically I read it all too. I was a bad steward and it's mine for the apologizing. Sometimes I make myself look so stupid. Anyway, I say, 3 school shootings in a week, it's time to arm both children and teachers (and principals) alike. You are absolutely right.

Jack said:


Actually, I am not in favor of arming the students below college age -- teenagers are too young to make decisions with serious consequences. However, I do think college students should be allowed to carry, especially the females. In the middle of a "date-rape," I'd like my daughter to be able to say, "Wait, at least let me get protection," and then go to her purse and pull out her .38 calibre "protection."

Angelo Chemello said:

Teachers with guns is a great idea. Teachers having guns could protect students from another killing like in columbine and VT. Yeah what if there are Insecure, socially insaine, angry teachers in the school that receive a gun. That can be stopped with tests before they recieve a gun. Having teachers that are also like security gaurds by having guns will save the school money because they wont have to hire so many security guards. And teachers with guns would give students a whole different mind set in comeing to school with guns or even doing bad things during class.

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